JeffB
01-16-2009, 11:09 AM
Here's something I posted over at HNI forums (which is where I spent most fo my time on the net in years past)
"This will not be a bow report per-se- just some general observations. I messed with alot of bows tonite-Mathews, Hoyt, PSE, Elite, Browning, Martin, BowTech, Diamond, Bear, and probably something I am forgetting.
Honestly, I was very disappointed with most of the bows on my "want to try" list when it came to the draw cycle. I was surprised (in a good way) by a few I did not think I'd like as much or had my doubts about.
Having not even drawn a bow in 3.5 to 4 years really puts a good perspective on what is and is not smooth. IMO, most of the "hot bows" out there are a far cry from the bows of just a few years ago- there seems to be another "ultimate speed" game being played by the industry, like there was in the late 90s. Trading comfort for a few more FPS. Yayyy... No thanks. http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/upfiles/smiley/rolleye0011.gif There was nothing out there that drew like the old BT feeedom cam, or the Mathews Outback or Q2. Well, I say that- the Bear Truth bows were pretty smooth I guess. Some of the bows were ALOT stiffer than others, but that said, all of them shot pretty nice- little recoil or vibe, all were quiet as could be (most all had some kind of string supressor arm thing), and most seemed to be tossing an arrow out pretty quick to extremely quick.
Out of the "Hybrids/binary/C&1/2s", the Elite and Hoyt bows were by far the smoothest and easiest to draw pound for pound, draw length for draw length. As I said previous, the Bear was the only smooth drawing single though the Mathews Drenalin was decent as was the S2 (which apparently is the same thing as the old switchback?)
I don't want to pi$$ off any PSE fans with my comments on the Xforce and X force SS cos I have little good to say other than they are built well- However the the Dream Season/Drury Brothers model was pretty cool. I'd def rock that bow in the woods.
The Bowtechs- gosh- They have really stepped up the past few years in the the fit and finish- The machining now is really absolute on par with ANYONE- gorgeous well machined risers and cams. The In-velvet is very cool. But I gotta be completely honest and say I thought the draw force curve was horrible on the 2009s (admiral and captain) as well as 2008s (commander and general). They felt 8 or 10 pounds heavier apples to Hoyt and Elite and they loaded up at the @$$ end of the draw. The Diamond Iceman didn't have the @$$ end load up, but was also stiff as heck from strat to finish. The Marquis was pretty nice but it was last years model with the string suppressor thing on the roller guard- which I did not like at all- looked like an accident waiting to happen.
On a positive note- every single one of the BTs shot with no vibe, no recoil, and almost no noise. The Valley was incredible- nice solid hole, super comfy but not torquey. I WANTED to buy one cos once it was back and you pulled the trigger it was just freaking brilliant- but the draw force curves just killed it for me. http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/image/s7.gif
Martin- meh...Martin, not much to say- Built extremely well as always, decent draw, wishy washy valley (single cam design, not sure of name) still vibey/shocky with that loud "plock" sound (even limbsavered and string supressored- gotta get rid of those half round steel pivots/limb pocket system they use if they want to ever improve on that)
Elite Z28/GT500 and the Hoyt AlphaMax 35/32 were definitely the stars of the evening. Could'nt make a legitimate complaint about any of them. They drew the smoothest, neither cam system had the a$$ end load up, all had nice comfy valleys (Z28 was a tad narrower), all were very quiet and had little vibe or recoil . The Elite's had a much harder wall (limb stop) which I prefer and ultimately that was the decision maker for me- I came home with the Elite GT500- 28.5" draw, peaks @ 63 pounds. No I did not chrono it.http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/upfiles/smiley/biggrin.gif
Here are some pics (The brass nock will be removed)
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y81/JeffBinny/DSC01438.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y81/JeffBinny/DSC01436.jpg
Thanks to everyone here at the Elite forum for the help you gave me last week regarding the bows. I was skeptical about them (knowing some of the absolute beasts Kevin has designed in the past- I've owned plenty of his bows since the beginning with an original Oregon VCIIIDX BK, through the entire BT line to 2004), but I was proven wrong. He finally got the performance, noise/recoil levels and the draw cycle all right. :applause:
"This will not be a bow report per-se- just some general observations. I messed with alot of bows tonite-Mathews, Hoyt, PSE, Elite, Browning, Martin, BowTech, Diamond, Bear, and probably something I am forgetting.
Honestly, I was very disappointed with most of the bows on my "want to try" list when it came to the draw cycle. I was surprised (in a good way) by a few I did not think I'd like as much or had my doubts about.
Having not even drawn a bow in 3.5 to 4 years really puts a good perspective on what is and is not smooth. IMO, most of the "hot bows" out there are a far cry from the bows of just a few years ago- there seems to be another "ultimate speed" game being played by the industry, like there was in the late 90s. Trading comfort for a few more FPS. Yayyy... No thanks. http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/upfiles/smiley/rolleye0011.gif There was nothing out there that drew like the old BT feeedom cam, or the Mathews Outback or Q2. Well, I say that- the Bear Truth bows were pretty smooth I guess. Some of the bows were ALOT stiffer than others, but that said, all of them shot pretty nice- little recoil or vibe, all were quiet as could be (most all had some kind of string supressor arm thing), and most seemed to be tossing an arrow out pretty quick to extremely quick.
Out of the "Hybrids/binary/C&1/2s", the Elite and Hoyt bows were by far the smoothest and easiest to draw pound for pound, draw length for draw length. As I said previous, the Bear was the only smooth drawing single though the Mathews Drenalin was decent as was the S2 (which apparently is the same thing as the old switchback?)
I don't want to pi$$ off any PSE fans with my comments on the Xforce and X force SS cos I have little good to say other than they are built well- However the the Dream Season/Drury Brothers model was pretty cool. I'd def rock that bow in the woods.
The Bowtechs- gosh- They have really stepped up the past few years in the the fit and finish- The machining now is really absolute on par with ANYONE- gorgeous well machined risers and cams. The In-velvet is very cool. But I gotta be completely honest and say I thought the draw force curve was horrible on the 2009s (admiral and captain) as well as 2008s (commander and general). They felt 8 or 10 pounds heavier apples to Hoyt and Elite and they loaded up at the @$$ end of the draw. The Diamond Iceman didn't have the @$$ end load up, but was also stiff as heck from strat to finish. The Marquis was pretty nice but it was last years model with the string suppressor thing on the roller guard- which I did not like at all- looked like an accident waiting to happen.
On a positive note- every single one of the BTs shot with no vibe, no recoil, and almost no noise. The Valley was incredible- nice solid hole, super comfy but not torquey. I WANTED to buy one cos once it was back and you pulled the trigger it was just freaking brilliant- but the draw force curves just killed it for me. http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/image/s7.gif
Martin- meh...Martin, not much to say- Built extremely well as always, decent draw, wishy washy valley (single cam design, not sure of name) still vibey/shocky with that loud "plock" sound (even limbsavered and string supressored- gotta get rid of those half round steel pivots/limb pocket system they use if they want to ever improve on that)
Elite Z28/GT500 and the Hoyt AlphaMax 35/32 were definitely the stars of the evening. Could'nt make a legitimate complaint about any of them. They drew the smoothest, neither cam system had the a$$ end load up, all had nice comfy valleys (Z28 was a tad narrower), all were very quiet and had little vibe or recoil . The Elite's had a much harder wall (limb stop) which I prefer and ultimately that was the decision maker for me- I came home with the Elite GT500- 28.5" draw, peaks @ 63 pounds. No I did not chrono it.http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/upfiles/smiley/biggrin.gif
Here are some pics (The brass nock will be removed)
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y81/JeffBinny/DSC01438.jpg
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y81/JeffBinny/DSC01436.jpg
Thanks to everyone here at the Elite forum for the help you gave me last week regarding the bows. I was skeptical about them (knowing some of the absolute beasts Kevin has designed in the past- I've owned plenty of his bows since the beginning with an original Oregon VCIIIDX BK, through the entire BT line to 2004), but I was proven wrong. He finally got the performance, noise/recoil levels and the draw cycle all right. :applause: